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Finley says Conservatives have set dollar ’targets’ for EI fraud, but not quotas

Human Resources Minister Diane Finley rises during Question Period in the House of Commons on Parliament Hill in Ottawa, Monday, Feb.25, 2013.   THE CANADIAN PRESS/Adrian Wyld

Human Resources Minister Diane Finley rises during Question Period in the House of Commons on Parliament Hill in Ottawa, Monday, Feb.25, 2013.

Published on February 25, 2013
Published on February 25, 2013
The Canadian Press  RSS Feed
Topics :
Employment Insurance , Conservatives , Service Canada , Montreal , Cavendish , Ottawa

Service Canada investigators have been given annual “performance objectives” to find $485,000 each in fraudulent or ineligible Employment Insurance claims per year, the Conservative government confirmed Monday.

However, Human Resources Minister Diane Finley vigorously denied that the targets amount to “quotas” — something Finley assured the House of Commons earlier this month do not exist.

“There were no quotas for individuals,” Finley maintained Monday after Montreal newspaper Le Devoir published government documents that showed the annual $485,000 figure for EI investigators.

“There are objectives, targets, to be sure. There’s a big difference between the two when it comes to motivating and managing staff,” said Finley.

Speaking in French, Finley noted that employees who don’t reach their targets do not face “negative consequences.”

The Harper government is under opposition fire amid a crackdown on EI claimants that includes sending government inspectors to people’s homes and establishing annual dollar targets for EI investigators.

The practices were not announced by the government but came to light as a result of media investigations.

The crackdown comes at a politically awkward time for the government as it fends off a series of spending controversies in its own backyard, the Conservative-dominated Senate.

Conservative Senator Mike Duffy said Friday he’ll pay back tens of thousands of dollars in housing allowance he received after claiming a cottage in Cavendish, P.E.I., was his principal residence. Duffy has lived in Ottawa since the 1970s.

Some senators’ expenses are being audited and others are being questioned on their housing claims.

NDP Leader Tom Mulcair said the Conservatives are treating the unemployed like criminals while circling the wagons on their well-paid Senate appointments.

Conservatives, Mulcair told the House, “don’t shy away from gratuitously accusing EI claimants of fraud but they don’t prevent their own senators from committing fraud.”

“Rather than saving $485,000 on the backs of these poor sods, why don’t they start sending inspectors to senators’ homes?” - NDP whip Nycole Turmel

NDP whip Nycole Turmel suggested the government’s efforts are misplaced.

“Rather than saving $485,000 on the backs of these poor sods, why don’t they start sending inspectors to senators’ homes?”

Finley said Service Canada stopped $500 million in ineligible EI payments last year but maintains the system “still lost hundreds of millions of dollars due to fraud.”

“The only people to lose if the opposition stops us from rooting out Employment Insurance fraud, are Canadians who follow the rules,” Finley repeated at least three times during question period in the House of Commons.

It was not clear how the NDP or Liberals could possibly stop the EI crackdown, but a public backlash could influence Conservative MPs.

Gerald Keddy, a veteran Nova Scotia Tory MP and parliamentary secretary for International Trade, said the debate over quotas versus targets reflected reporters “working too hard on semantics.”

“The whole issue with EI is simply to attempt to prevent abuse,” Keddy said outside the Commons.

“And the idea that people who are on EI that could take a job should take a job, I think is agreed to by most Canadians.”

Bob Rae, the interim Liberal leader, said whatever you call it, setting dollar targets for enforcement officers leads to trouble.

“I think the worry all the way through is when you have a quota — whether it’s for a parking ticket enforcement officer or whether it’s for somebody working on employment insurance — is that the target becomes the quota and that you find reasons and ways in which to find people and catch people that might in fact be very, very unfair,” said Rae.

 

 

Comments

  • Username
    proud fisherman
    - February 26, 2013 at 14:15:56

    I'm willing to bet that some of the people on here that are happy with these changes to the ei program are either government employees or business owners..Now with that being said i happen to have friends who do one or the other...so lets talk about fraud shall we...#1 @ social services...my tax dollars should not be used to fund a job that allows someone to sit on there ass and play farm town or other little silly games on facebook...#2 department of natural resources..."it's to hot or to cold to go outside and cut that tree down"#3 department of fisheries and oceans.."I'm gonna drive around all day and burn gas payed for with taxpayer dollars and look for someone to shoot with my pistol"I could go on and on this is fun...Now for you proud business owners#1"Honey...i'm just gonna pay this guy $10 an hour cash so he can draw his pogey for the week and it will save us some money...#2 "that deck we built on last summer,we can say we used the lumber to build an office and claim it on our taxes"...wow these loopholes are great....#3"lets invite our employees over every friday after work,we will buy the beer,keep the receipt,take the cost of the beer out of there paycheck and claim it on our taxes as entertainment"Quite the rant et...the fact is that fraud is all around us,it's just that maritimers are being used as scapegoats once again by either the government or anybody else who does not want to admit any wrong doing themselves..I would also like to add that i'm not usually one to criticize anybody for what line of work they are in...but since I feel like i'm being attacked, half of you that are on here complaining about seasonal workers and fisherman who are on ei give me a f...in break you wouldn't know what a hard days work was if it slapped you in the mouth..come out on the deck of a boat for a day with me...but you won't because most of ya couldn't hack it, not even on a fine day...I said my piece..everybody have a nice day

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    • Username
      The Facilitator
      - February 26, 2013 at 22:14:38

      So you think its OK to pay 5 or 6 hundred dollars into the EI regime every year then pull out $15K or more every year? Why don't you look for a job when you can't fish? If fishing is so tough then why don't you find another career where you don't draw from the EI fund every single year more than you ever put into the system. Sad how you rationalize this by calling everyone else a fraudster. Stop being a leach on society.

  • Username
    SG
    - February 26, 2013 at 12:38:09

    To: Don't Bash Shea: (To say that this is her fault is completely unfair, she is trying her best and doesn't want to lose her seat in the cabinet.) Re: not wanting to loose her seat in the Cabinet, maybe that's why she opted to take leave in the house just mere secs. before the Vote on EI was to take place. She said it was due to a :Personal Matter. Minister Shea still hasn't offered any explanation regarding the Personal Matter. EI for many Islanders is also a personal matter and one of great importance especially for those who haven't been able to find employment and have no other option except EI. As a Minister representing PEI wouldn't Islanders be considered a Personal Matter?

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  • Username
    targets
    - February 26, 2013 at 09:39:36

    I think the time is coming soon that the different sectors need to start looking after their own seasonal help so the working class can stop complaining about the few dollars they pay to the EI fund and start complaining because they are paying twice the price for everything.Simply by doubling the cost of every sector only 1 would live for another day which is farming cause noone can do without food. Now the working have become the poor and the unemployed becomes 45% richer

    Submit a comment

    • Username
      Angus
      - February 26, 2013 at 11:16:34

      Only on PEI would there be a protest about cheaters being looked for. What is exactly wrong with checking to see if folks claiming EI are entitled to it, so that the fund is able to provide for those entitled to it. Time for folks to get off their arses and look out for themselves, instead of looking to the government. And why would people not want the cheaters caught, since they are ready to have everyone else nailed for crooked behaviour. Bunch of hypocrits.

  • Username
    SG
    - February 26, 2013 at 08:51:27

    Canadians need to organize a Protest against the Conservative Gov. Enough is Enough. While Senators enjoy a six digit salary, plus a five digit living expense for their Second Residence, paid Air Fare Travel, etc. etc. our Gov. decides to make it more difficult for our many unemployed Canadians to receive EI !! Produce MORE JOB OPPORTUNITIES in Canada and there wouldn't be so many Canadians NEEDING EI ! The WEST is not the only area of Canada! However it certainly seems to be! Initiate a Performance Objective for our 105 Senators.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Peiguy
    - February 26, 2013 at 08:46:34

    I believe we have created a system of inappropriate use. The EI was designed to provide income for those who find themselves out of work. It was not designed as a fallback income system for those who A) choose not to work at some times of the year or B) cannot motivate themselves to take the jobs that are available that they may be qualified for. A different system should be installed for those with increasing premiums based on frequency of use. like any other Insurance! I paid into EI for close to 40 years before my first claim. the amount that I received was inadequate based on the amount I have contributed over the years. Why?? because of "regular EI claimants. Not enough money to go around. If there is no job for you where you are. Move, go to school or take what you can find, like our fathers before us and like 90 percent of the other countries in the world. The users of EI not the Govt have screwed up this system.

    Submit a comment

    • Username
      more complaining
      - February 26, 2013 at 09:54:53

      Not hard to get all farm labourers off the ei. Lets just double the cost of food and cover their wages year round then see if the goverment will reduce the ei premuims. AS IF. The year round workers should be ok paying double for food since they may save $10 a week after all they'd still be paying EI premuims for the seasonal goverment employee's.

  • Username
    Slyfox
    - February 26, 2013 at 02:10:52

    If service canada reps show up at your door,call the police on them because they are trespassing on private property and since you did not invite them onto your property they are breaking the law.

    Submit a comment

    • Username
      The Facilitator
      - February 26, 2013 at 22:38:55

      Another urban myth. If you believe this, I have a good deal for you on the Confederation Bridge.

  • Bill Kays
    Bill Kays
    - February 26, 2013 at 00:44:16

    We are being ruled by tyrants that have no concern or care about the suffering they cause or their collective responsibility for that suffering. We are the new cannon fodder for the new royalty in Ottawa.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Absolutely fed up Conservative
    - February 25, 2013 at 22:48:32

    This should be the straw which breaks the Tory back in the Maritimes. Put the works to the little people who are trying to survive while letting people like the Senators waste millions of dollars without any real Audit control. Mrs Shea you will be fortunate to save your deposit next election.

    Submit a comment

    • Username
      Don't Bash Shea
      - February 26, 2013 at 08:58:17

      I don't know why some people continue to bring Shea into this. Do people realize that if she wasn't in the cabinet the province would have missed out on millions of dollars invested into the province as the Island would not have had a voice. To say that this is her fault is completely unfair, she is trying her best and doesn't want to lose her seat in the cabinet.

    • Username
      Frankie
      - February 26, 2013 at 09:59:33

      I don't think they were bashing Mrs. Shea, just warning her that her job is in jeopardy. There was nothing in the post that blamed her, but with that said, I don't hear her standing up for the people who elected her either. I mean really, getting up to "pee" at the exact moment when she should have been voting???

    • Username
      fire SHEA dont bash
      - February 26, 2013 at 10:23:30

      Shea defends the EI changes then walks out on her vote on reform it.Over half the people she is there to fight for will be affected and someone has the gull to say don't bash SHEA. You must be part of her family! If she had half the gull she might be able to do what she was put there to do and not do what she is told to do by Harper.I hope noone forget what she has done to us and gets her out for someone with a spine.

  • Username
    concernedislander
    - February 25, 2013 at 22:14:40

    Its certainly getting too be ah sad day in society when the Feds are attacking the working poor to cover up there own well organised fraud scam off the backs off the Canadian tax payers they are doing such ah great job they have the average Canadan citizen convinced there biggest enemy is the seasonal workers and the ones who repeatly draw EI i find it amuzing just how many people whom are being sucked in by one off the greatest scams the Feds are stealing from the pension and the ei fund while the people are to focused on the so called EI fraud as diharp finsley would put it.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Jim
    - February 25, 2013 at 21:49:52

    How about getting rid of FINLEY that would save around $200,000 or so year .Just by getting rid of one person.I,am sure she could get a job at tims.Why does the government think the EI fund is theirs.It,s not they just want to use it as another tax.How can they say the money is lost it all goes back in the economy in the form of heat,food,clothes,gas,rent.I don,t think any of it is going to offshore bank accounts.Harper thinks him self as KING.HE is doing a very poor job of helping the people who put him there.I will never vote P.C again.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Adolphus
    - February 25, 2013 at 21:28:00

    Been on EI lately, Bill? Doesn't sound like it.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Joe Blow
    - February 25, 2013 at 21:24:34

    Government needs to have nothing to do with the EI fund...they need to stop using the money in it and need to stop concerning themselves with it. If they are going to play with the EI money and make poor investments with it, then Canadian taxpayers should have the choice to whether they want to have deductions off their pay cheques going towards EI or not. We are forced to pay into the fund, so the government should leave it alone. I pay into the fund so it is there if and when I need it...I'm not paying into it so Harper can take money from it and waste it.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Gerry
    - February 25, 2013 at 21:09:09

    While I agree EI fraud does exist, and it must be kept in check; in my mind it equates to the practise of providing bonuses/performance pay (in addition to handsome salaries) for supposedly performing the tasks he/she was hired to do in the first place (e.g. substantively). I will never get my head around that blatant abuse of taxpayers dollars either.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Gerry
    - February 25, 2013 at 21:08:32

    While I agree EI fraud does exist, and it must be kept in check; in my mind it equates to the practise of providing bonuses/performance pay (in addition to handsome salaries) for supposedly performing the tasks he/she was hired to do in the first place (e.g. substantively). I will never get my head around that blatant abuse of taxpayers dollars either.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    waldorf
    - February 25, 2013 at 21:08:26

    Time for protests in the streets... Steve Harper has to be made a where that seasonal workers are not the crooks of Canada. There has been no Prime Minister like Harper. Harper is a bully to the poor much like Ralph klein ..How does he have such control over the Gail Sheas , The Peter Mckays .Human Resources Minister Diane Finley stands ther mighty then thou , her husbands is a Senator she drug tons of money from the tax payers.Finley has promoted increased private-sector involvement in health services. She was the founder of Canada's largest publicly funded ambulance service company, Finley should try grading potaoes , standing 14 hours a day on a lobster line or working in the tourist industry , or any other seasonal jobs.. these heartless excuse of elected officals care a rats ass about the lower income earner of Canada.

    Submit a comment

    • Username
      The Facilitaor
      - February 26, 2013 at 22:30:04

      WALDORF - What a bunch of hogwash. There is all kinds of fraud going on with the EI Program and everyone on PEI knows it. Bashing Steven Harper for doing his job is ridiculous. I for one am pleased to see the crackdown. It is absolutely ludicrous that we have the highest rate of unemployment in the country but need to bring in migrant workers to fill the job vacancies. Why should people be collecting EI while jobs that they are qualified for are going unfilled? Aren't you embarrassed to be sitting at home collecting pogey every year? Do you have no self respect?

  • Username
    whatajoke
    - February 25, 2013 at 21:06:13

    What a bunch of two faced politicians,chase down the little guy that makes maybe $20,ooo but let the appointed and elected people earn $50,000.No wrong,LIE and STEAL from hard working Canadians.

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Targets too low
    - February 25, 2013 at 20:45:20

    With a little effort you could find that much EI fraud in most small communities on PEI, with 7800 people drawing pogey last month there are thousands of dollars flowing through the system. Between bogus ROEs, purchased "hours of insurable employment" and providing stamps for people other than the person earning them the system is full of fraud. Oh, did I mention working under the table for cash? People feel entitled to rip off this program, it is the government they say, they think it is ok. There are people who would never tell a lie or take 5 cents from their neighbour but if they have to buy a few stamps to get the pogey going, well that's ok. And.........more than a few of these pogey people are laying in the sun down south while the rest of us work to insure the EI system has enough in it to give them a check each week!

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    Bill
    - February 25, 2013 at 20:08:52

    Nothing wrong with establishing targets. That's the way business operates and frequently builds a bonus system around attaining those targets. Nothing new with this, except for the political football that it's become. NDP & Liberals creating issues to get into the news. Makes them seem far weaker to me

    Submit a comment

  • Username
    John Getson
    - February 25, 2013 at 19:54:29

    Minister Findley, exactly what is the difference between a "quota" and a "target"...? "...EI investigators tasked to to find $485,000 each in fraudulent or ineligible Employment Insurance claims per year" ...can't find enough fraudulent claims to reach target can always deny the shortfall?

    Submit a comment

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